Tonight I read a post from a participant on AVFM’s forum named Wio, and here’s the snippet I’d like to zero in on:
Taking a risk does not make you less of a man and taking precaution does not make you a greater man, so I see no contradiction here. MGTOW is not some standard of how to be a “real” man, and I’m pretty sure we all agreed such standards need not exist.
Are there not better men than others? Men more deserving of being esteemed and treated with honor and respect more than some others? And couldn’t the same also be said of women? Even while taking into account whatever differences we generally may have.
The question really is where we draw the lines, and obviously that can divvy up in countless ways across the spectrum. I understand what I personally esteem and appreciate in men, as well as what strikes me as notably honorable in women. A bit tricky trying to spell that out for others since it’s a nuanced understanding within myself that has evolved over time (and likely will only continue to evolve). But I do distinguish between people and don’t pretend they/we are all constituted equally. No. We are not all equal, and that’s not just solely determined along sex/gender lines. Simply put, some men are pieces of shit, as are some women, for whatever reasons. How many? Who can clearly say? But we know lowlifes exist across both of the sexes. Fact of life, subjectively determined as it can’t help but be.
So let’s stop for a moment and think about how it divvies up among males in particular, since some in the conversation pertaining to the in-fighting between “MGTOWs” and MRAs, particularly folks being haphazardly labeled as “traditionalists” simply because they choose to marry (or at least might be open to and tolerant of marriage). That’s somehow “the enemy” now, yeah — I’ve read and watched some of this shit unfold. Makes me long for a better hobby. LOL
Men are not all equal, just as humans in general are not all equal. Can’t force us to all be either. Different natures, different genes, different socialization experiences, different drives. Etc. Not one and the same. Might be equal in some sense under that which we like to call God, or perhaps to a larger extent nowadays operating according to that which has been deemed The Law — that much I agree with. But each and all equally constituted? Not a chance.
A few are very sick and demented, as we’re all aware of and crime stories attest to. Some others out here are feeling very jilted, and perhaps in however many cases justifiably so through no fault of their own (at least initially). But a number of these jilted people are working with very limited experiences that they feel profoundly impacted by; sometimes legitimately so, but for others it’s like they fixated on the loss or heartache so intensely for so long that it warped them. They became a hater. That is, in this case, one driven to destroy that which is sacred to others out of covetousness and spite. They who began desiring to paint it all black. Some envy you and yet cannot or will not be like you. Some scorn you for having access to what they think they want and should be entitled to. And however many believe they ought to act on impulse and work to take away what another has because they’re so damned miserable with their own existence that they have grown to strongly resent others with lives that resemble their idyllic fantasies. That serving as just one example of how destructive drives may play out. There unarguably are those who aim to directly prey on folks who threaten their own insecurities. We know these cases do exist.
That initial comment just tapped into a can of worms I’ve been pondering on a while now. In reality, not all men are on the same side. Can’t be. Fundamental differences between them do exist. Just as not all women are on the same side as one another, though females are generally reported to be more collectivist or at least communal in nature. But in terms of masculine ideologies — doesn’t work that way. Impossible to all be on the same “team.” That’s gender-ideology-taken-too-far way of thinking, and it won’t work, not unless the haters all came to rule key social hierarchies and sufficiently intimidated most other males into adapting to their ways of being or standing down — not likely to happen.
All women aren’t one way and looking for the same things necessarily in a mate, same as with men. We know this. And yet people sit there and debate as if they subscribe to some universalized truth. Like the sexes, categorically, having irreconcilable differences and therefore sex segregation is in order (?). Some people online like to get nuts on this shit, especially young people operating with rather limited life experiences while saturated with ideologies. What’s most important winds up being obscured by comparably trivial distractions. But there are strikingly different worldviews among men that will prove every bit as irreconcilable as, if not more so than, the natural divide between the sexes.
But getting back to the original YT topic threads in question… Simply enjoying one’s marriage, even if both spouses work, is now considered “traditionalist”? Living together is now deemed “traditionalist”? What next? Gonna label having a girlfriend as “traditionalist”? Having sex with women? Even acknowledging women? How Orwellian. Seriously.
People are blowing my mind. Not sure what to make of what all we’re trying to do here. I can sympathize to varying degrees, but damn. We’re not all on the same team here, not according to sex or race or class or whatever else we may identify with. And the “enemy” of my “enemy” isn’t always necessarily my friend by default. Not a secret.
This notion of all men coming together won’t happen because males tend to be more individualistic. That unavoidably matters. So males are forced to adopt different strategies as a result. However many clans wind up going their own ways. It will be interesting to observe how that may unfold. That is, if the online “manosphere” can manage to not get mired in unproductive drivel the way Feminism has.
Anyway, enough rambling for tonight.
March 18, 2015: Decided to record reading this post aloud: